> because these thing called BEST MOVE and BAD MOVE there in chess
The thing is that there is no known general objective criteria for "best" and "bad" moves. The best we have so far is based on engine evaluations, but as I said before that is because chess engines are better at searching the board's state space than humans, not because chess engines have solved chess in the mathematical sense. Engines are quite capable of misevaluating positions, as demonstrated quite well by the Top Chess Engine Championship [0] where one engine thinks it made a good move while the other thinks that move is bad, and this is especially the case when resources are limited.
The closest we are to solving chess are via tablebases, which are far from covering the entire state space and are basically as much of an exemplar of pure brute force as you can get.
> "chess engines are still capable of making mistakes", I'm sorry no
If you think chess engines are infalliable, then why does the Top Chess Engine Championship exist? Surely if chess engines could not make mistakes they would always agree on a position's evaluation and what move should be made, and therefore such an exercise would be pointless?
> inaccurate yes but not mistake
From the perspective to attaining perfect play an inaccuracy is a mistake.
"The thing is that there is no known general objective criteria for "best" and "bad" moves."
are you playing chess or not?????? if you playing chess then its oblivious how to differentiate bad move and best move
Yes it is objective, these thing called best move not without reason
"If you think chess engines are infalliable, then why does the Top Chess Engine Championship exist?"
to create better chess engine like what do even talking about here????, are you saying just because there are older bad engine that mean this thing is pointless ????
if you playing chess up to a decent level 1700+ (like me), you know that these argument its wrong and I assure you to learn chess to a decent level
up until that point that you know high level chess is brute force games and therefore solvable math
> if you playing chess then its oblivious how to differentiate bad move and best move
The key words in what I said are "general" and "objective". Yes, it's possible to determine "good" or "bad" moves in specific positions. There's no known method to determine "good" or "bad" moves in arbitrary positions, as would be required for chess to be considered strongly solved.
Furthermore, if it's "obvious" how to differentiate good and bad moves then we should never see engines blundering, right?
So (for example) how do you explain this game between Stockfish and Leela where Stockfish blunders a seemingly winning position [0]? After 37... Rdd8 both Stockfish and Leela think white is clearly winning (Stockfish's evaluation is +4.00, while Leela's evaluation is +3.81), but after 38. Nxb5 Leela's evaluation plummets to +0.34 while Stockfish's evaluation remains at +4.00. In the end, it turns out Leela was correct after 40... Rxc6 Stockfish's evaluation also drops from +4.28 to 0.00 as it realizes that Leela has a forced stalemate.
Or this game also between Stockfish and Leela where Leela blunders into a forced mating sequence and doesn't even realize it for a few moves [1]?
Engines will presumably always play what they think is the "best" move, but clearly sometimes this "best" move is wrong. Evidently, this means differentiating "good" and "bad" moves is not always obvious.
> Yes it is objective, these thing called best move not without reason
If it's objective, then why is it possible for engines to disagree on whether a move is good or bad, as they do in the above example and others?
> to create better chess engine like what do even talking about here????
The ability to create better chess engines necessarily implies that chess engines can and do make mistakes, contrary to what you asserted.
> are you saying just because there are older bad engine that mean this thing is pointless ????
No. What I'm saying is that your explanation for why chess engines are better than humans is wrong. Chess engines are not better than humans because they have solved chess in the mathematical sense; chess engines are better than humans because they search the state space faster and more efficiently than humans (at least until you reach 7 pieces on the board).
> up until that point that you know high level chess is brute force games and therefore solvable math
"Solvable" and "solved" are two very different things. Chess is solvable, in theory. Chess is very far from being solved.
The thing is that there is no known general objective criteria for "best" and "bad" moves. The best we have so far is based on engine evaluations, but as I said before that is because chess engines are better at searching the board's state space than humans, not because chess engines have solved chess in the mathematical sense. Engines are quite capable of misevaluating positions, as demonstrated quite well by the Top Chess Engine Championship [0] where one engine thinks it made a good move while the other thinks that move is bad, and this is especially the case when resources are limited.
The closest we are to solving chess are via tablebases, which are far from covering the entire state space and are basically as much of an exemplar of pure brute force as you can get.
> "chess engines are still capable of making mistakes", I'm sorry no
If you think chess engines are infalliable, then why does the Top Chess Engine Championship exist? Surely if chess engines could not make mistakes they would always agree on a position's evaluation and what move should be made, and therefore such an exercise would be pointless?
> inaccurate yes but not mistake
From the perspective to attaining perfect play an inaccuracy is a mistake.
[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_Chess_Engine_Championship