> The Agile Manifesto cult swept aside all that silly formalism. "Too heavy!"
The Agile Manifesto puts close contact with the end users and domain experts as a fundamental principle (actually two principles, out of four). I do think you have the wrong culprit on your mind.
Agreed. When devs, QA, and other doers have a direct line to customers, there's no problem. In my personal experience.
That arrangement has been rare. More common is gatekeeping and incompetence. (Which may be the same thing.)
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I've never figured out how to do "agile" QA/QC/Test. I'd don't even know what it'd look like. And, yes, my prior experiences and expectations may be keeping from seeing the new paradigm. Which is why I keep asking.
The best candidate I've read about is "Test Into Prod". But I have not yet done that strategy in real life. Soon (fingers crossed).
Oh, and "bug bashes", are pretty great. Where everyone examines logs together and either explains or eliminates exceptions. That needs to be the norm.
Well, with Scrum or whatever usually passes as agile, I have no idea either. And I imagine people can't really answer your question, because almost nobody practices the stuff on the manifesto. The motto would be certainly be to bring the customer around to specify your tests, but the actual procedure is a bit hard to imagine the details.
Anyawy, my comment was just to point that it's not exactly the manifesto stopping you.
The Agile Manifesto puts close contact with the end users and domain experts as a fundamental principle (actually two principles, out of four). I do think you have the wrong culprit on your mind.